Verbal question you found somewhere else? General issue with idioms or grammar? Random verbal question? These questions belong here.
shohet.mark
Course Students
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:29 pm
 

Use of the word "that"

by shohet.mark Fri Aug 15, 2014 4:00 pm

I recall reading somewhere in the Sentence Correction SG that the word "that" should be used after action verbs when connecting two clauses in a sentence; the reason is to reduce ambiguity. For example:

"The students believed that they would make it to class on time."

is preferred over

"The students believed they would make it to class on time."

The one exception is when the verb "to say" is used, since it should be clear to the reader that the sentence is about to transition into what someone is saying:

"Mary said she wanted to go home": correct usage

"Mary said that she wanted to go home": not incorrect, but the "that" is not necessary.


My two questions are:

1) Is my understanding of this rule, including the examples above, correct (i.e. always use "that" after action verbs in this structure, unless the action word is "to say")?

2) Is this a definitive rule that the GMAT always respects, or is it more of a preference?

Thank you.
RonPurewal
Students
 
Posts: 19744
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:23 am
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by RonPurewal Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:37 pm

You should just know that both versions are fine.
The inclusion/omission of "that" is almost entirely a matter of style. Style is not tested on this exam, so, basically, this whole thing is a non-issue here.
shohet.mark
Course Students
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:29 pm
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by shohet.mark Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:20 am

Ron,

What about this problem/explanation from MGMAT CAT 6? It seems as if the answer explanation is stating that the "that" is necessary here. I'm trying to figure out if I should be removing any answers/looking for splits based on the word "that" in these types of examples. Thanks.



A recent report from the Bureau of Justice states although only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, approximately one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison or on parole or probation.

A) although only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, approximately one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison or on parole or probation.

B) that while less than a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

C) that although less than one out of every one hundred American people are in prison, more than three percent of Americans are either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

D) that while only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans is either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

E) while only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans is either in prison, on parole, or probation.


The primary purpose of this sentence is to describe the two recent findings in a report from the Bureau of Justice. The sentence uses the bossy verb “states” to introduce the two findings. The verb “states” must be followed by “that.” Each of these findings is a stand-alone clause, meaning they each contain their own subject verb pairing. Further, the second clause introduces a parallel structure with a list of three items and the word “or”.

(A) This sentence incorrectly omits the word “that”, which is necessary for the bossy verb “states” when followed by a clause. Additionally, the sentence incorrectly matches the subject-verb pairing in the phrase “one out of every thirty two Americans are”. The subject of this sentence is the singular noun “one”, whereas the verb is the plural noun “are”.

(B) The sentence incorrectly matches the subject-verb pairing in the phrase “one out of every thirty two Americans are”. The subject of this sentence is the singular noun “one”, whereas the verb is the plural noun “are”.

(C) The sentence incorrectly matches the subject-verb pairing in the phrase “one out of every one hundred American people are”. The subject of this sentence is the singular noun “one”, whereas the verb is the plural noun “are”.

(D) CORRECT. This sentence correctly uses the conjunction “that” after the bossy verb “states”, correctly pairs the subjects and verbs within the two clauses, and correctly uses parallelism with “in prison, on parole, or on probation.”

(E) This sentence incorrectly omits the word “that”, which is necessary for the bossy verb “states” when followed by a clause. Additionally, the sentence breaks parallelism with the phrase, “is either in prison, on parole, or probation”. The first two items in the list are the preposition phrases “in prison” and “on parole”, whereas the last item is the noun “probation”.
RonPurewal
Students
 
Posts: 19744
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:23 am
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by RonPurewal Mon Aug 18, 2014 12:46 pm

In a sentence with this many parts, "that" is necessary to specify relationships.

E.g., consider these two sentences (both correct)

Tom told me last year that his second child had been born.
—> Tom told me, "I have 2 kids now." He told me this last year.

Tom told me that(,) last year(,) his second child had been born.
—> Tom told me (more recently), "Kid #2 was born last year."

Without "that", this sentence becomes meaningless because it's impossible to determine exactly what was said. So, if anything is an issue here, that's it.
LynC26
Prospective Students
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2016 6:17 pm
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by LynC26 Tue Aug 23, 2016 12:59 am

Hi,Ron.
I wanna know the use of either...or...here.
Normally we say either X or Y,but here it goes either X,Y,or Z in the correct answer.I googled a lot and heard different voices about this usage.I don't know if it is OK to use this way.Plz clarify.Thx in advance!
LynC26
Prospective Students
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2016 6:17 pm
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by LynC26 Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:04 am

I mean in this problem,the correct answer



A recent report from the Bureau of Justice states although only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, approximately one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison or on parole or probation.

A) although only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, approximately one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison or on parole or probation.

B) that while less than a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

C) that although less than one out of every one hundred American people are in prison, more than three percent of Americans are either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

D) that while only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans is either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

E) while only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans is either in prison, on parole, or probation.


The primary purpose of this sentence is to describe the two recent findings in a report from the Bureau of Justice. The sentence uses the bossy verb “states” to introduce the two findings. The verb “states” must be followed by “that.” Each of these findings is a stand-alone clause, meaning they each contain their own subject verb pairing. Further, the second clause introduces a parallel structure with a list of three items and the word “or”.

(A) This sentence incorrectly omits the word “that”, which is necessary for the bossy verb “states” when followed by a clause. Additionally, the sentence incorrectly matches the subject-verb pairing in the phrase “one out of every thirty two Americans are”. The subject of this sentence is the singular noun “one”, whereas the verb is the plural noun “are”.

(B) The sentence incorrectly matches the subject-verb pairing in the phrase “one out of every thirty two Americans are”. The subject of this sentence is the singular noun “one”, whereas the verb is the plural noun “are”.

(C) The sentence incorrectly matches the subject-verb pairing in the phrase “one out of every one hundred American people are”. The subject of this sentence is the singular noun “one”, whereas the verb is the plural noun “are”.

(D) CORRECT. This sentence correctly uses the conjunction “that” after the bossy verb “states”, correctly pairs the subjects and verbs within the two clauses, and correctly uses parallelism with “in prison, on parole, or on probation.”

(E) This sentence incorrectly omits the word “that”, which is necessary for the bossy verb “states” when followed by a clause. Additionally, the sentence breaks parallelism with the phrase, “is either in prison, on parole, or probation”. The first two items in the list are the preposition phrases “in prison” and “on parole”, whereas the last item is the noun “probation”.[/quote]
RonPurewal
Students
 
Posts: 19744
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:23 am
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by RonPurewal Fri Aug 26, 2016 2:57 am

as per the forum rules, we need a citation of the original source of that problem. thanks.
LynC26
Prospective Students
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2016 6:17 pm
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by LynC26 Fri Aug 26, 2016 9:36 pm

this problem is from manhattan CAT test.
A recent report from the Bureau of Justice states although only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, approximately one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison or on parole or probation.

A) although only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, approximately one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison or on parole or probation.

B) that while less than a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans are either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

C) that although less than one out of every one hundred American people are in prison, more than three percent of Americans are either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

D) that while only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans is either in prison, on parole, or on probation.

E) while only a fraction of a percent of the American population is in prison, one out of every thirty two Americans is either in prison, on parole, or probation.

OA is C,The problem is that the colored part uses eitherX,Y,orZ to parallelX,Y,and Z. Is this usage of either...or...acceptable?
RonPurewal
Students
 
Posts: 19744
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:23 am
 

Re: Use of the word "that"

by RonPurewal Fri Sep 02, 2016 7:49 pm

please post the problem in the appropriate folder. thank you.